Business, Bigfoot and the Paranormal with DS Mike Anne

Stephen J: (00:11)
Welcome to behind the tin, a podcast that introduces you to the heroic men and women who wear the tin while protecting our community and hearing about the extraordinary things they're doing, their badges in their locker. Today's podcast is brought to you by those guys. print.com. Those guys print for all your custom and apparel needs. Those guys. print.com. Steven Jay, the good Lieutenant along with Justin, the civilian producer here today. How are you today, sir? We have a, uh, great guest. I'm so excited. This guy is off the charts to me. This guy brings, uh, a perspective that we don't normally get. Yeah, I'm, I'm looking at his biography here and it, it just really seems, seems crazy. I mean, I'm not so sure where we go with this guy. I mean, he's a law enforcement officer, Western New York. We're gonna get that information. We're gonna get about his business.

Stephen J: (00:58)
He'll he a very successful business he's running. Yeah. But it's really the other extracurricular investigations that he's involved in that I really want to hear about. Yeah. Very wild perspective, for sure. So let's, uh, let's get to it. Let's jump in. So Steven Jay here, the good Lieutenant along with Justin, the civilian producer, our guest, as we described is Michael Ann, a guy I've known for quite some time guy, that's into so many different things that this conversation has got me excited for weeks. And I mean that in the best way possible so Mike, welcome to behind the 10

Mike: (01:35)
Good evening and good afternoon where we're at. So are you guys doing this evening?

Stephen J: (01:40)
We're doing great. We're doing great. Like, uh, let let's let's hear about so people know where you work and what you do, cuz I really like to start with that little bit of a

Mike: (01:47)
Background. Okay. Uh, I'm a Sheriff's deputy. Uh, I work in, uh, in New York and I've been there 21 years and I've done everything from courts to road, to corrections, to Intel recovery diver for little bit of everything, help out with little community policing every so often. So, uh, keeps me on, on the go and keeps me moving for these last 21. And if people

Stephen J: (02:11)
Don't understand that accident, that's not a downstate New York accident

Mike: (02:14)
That I'm hearing. No, no, that's a Western

Stephen J: (02:15)
New York accent. That's a Western New York. That's like where New York actually has trees and unpaid roads, right?

Mike: (02:21)
Yes, yes, yes. You could. You can actually go out and hike and enjoy nature and see bears and deer and you know, most people don't

Stephen J: (02:30)
New York

Mike: (02:31)
Rights. Yeah. It's the real New York, 90% of the it's the 90% of the state that nobody knows exists. Yes. Yes. It's not the point that everybody thinks I'm downstate. I'm closer to Canada than I am to the city. So put it lately.

Stephen J: (02:46)
So what do you, what are you doing now, Mike? You've been there a a while. What's your current role?

Mike: (02:50)
Uh, current role is, uh, I do Intel and, uh, I assist with our dive team and I help out with some community polic programs, uh, designed some, some interesting little programs to get out in the community and get the community working with law enforcement.

Stephen J: (03:04)
So as you know, this podcast, isn't just about what you do on the job, but more importantly about what you do when that, that tin, that badge is in your locker. And you do some crazy stuff. Like I talk about you and people like no way, you know, a guy that does all those things. So let's first talk about your business. Let's, let's start there. X a tactical X,

Mike: (03:23)
A tactical is a company designed to make tools for military law enforcement and professional chef. So knives, sundry, little tools for those guys that need to get out of, uh, really bad locations that really to get guys home. Uh, it started as, uh, I've been doing martial arts for over 30 years, couple of different styles, everything from, uh, wing Kung Fu, which I've done for quite a few years, started that in college. And then I switched to Filipino martial arts and in getting into Filipino martial arts, I got tied in with Doug Marka, if you watch forge and fire. Uh, Doug was one of my first instructors in Filipino martial arts. And then I got tied in with his instructors and started making some knives with Doug and for Doug. And we started working on some other things and I subcontracted out with him to some, uh, some military contractors. We were teaching some special tier one, tier two guys on some close quarter combat stuff. So I designed help design some equipment for them, uh, for again, uh, that little intermediary range between, uh, your firearm and your ground combat stuff.

Stephen J: (04:34)
And I've known you for quite some time and I've had the, the blessing of getting my hands on one of your knives. And I'll tell you, man, what a beautiful, not only functional piece of equipment, but just a beautiful work of art. And I'm so proud to have it. And you know, I, I love having it cuz it's, it is, it's a, it's a piece of equipment that, you know, you can't live without some days.

Mike: (04:52)
When I, when, you know, when I started designing this stuff, I was thinking about the first responder. Uh, like I said, I've been doing recovery diving for almost 18 years. Been diving a little longer than that. And I was always worried about the diver or the, uh, paratrooper or something like that. That was more worried about what his knife was because he spent $6,000 on a blade and he drops it to the bottom of the ocean or out of a tree. What stupid thing he's gonna do to go get it. So I try to make a knife that was, uh, reasonably priced. So you didn't have to go home and tell your wife or your girlfriend that you put your entire food bill, you know, into a knife. So, uh, it it's been a, it been a pleasure. And again, the, in the instructors I've had along the way have helped, uh, guide my designs. Um, I also have a background in archeology and anthropology. So looking at those old school rule blades, that medieval stuff, the, the hand, uh, forged stuff, the hand chipped stone tools are, are past very influential in one a building. It's not just what looks pretty and shows up nice in a movie scene or something like that.

Stephen J: (05:59)
Oh, I, I will still say it's still pretty. It's functional. Oh,

Mike: (06:02)
Oh, it's functional. It's pretty. Yeah. I appreciate that. So, and I've done some stuff for like some professional chefs as well as our military guys. And stuff's been field tested around the world by military guys, professional divers, the dive stuff has been very limited. Um, that was one of my original blades were, were for dive knives and my mentor and diving pass. And I kind of put that project aside, but it's coming back this summer. So it's, uh, those will be out floating around again soon. So

Stephen J: (06:33)
When, when did the business start?

Mike: (06:35)
Uh, we've been about 10 years. We've been, been doing stuff. So, and your main,

Stephen J: (06:40)
Um, really sale mechanism,

Mike: (06:43)
Uh, word of mouth. Uh, I have an inter I have a, a Facebook page. I have an Instagram page. I have a website website doesn't get really pushed around too much, but it's mostly word of mouth again, small, small specialty stuff. Um, not, I looked, I had a chance for large production years ago working for, with a gentleman who wanted to do some stuff down in, uh, the islands. He wanted a, he was a Bahamian defense forces or something like that. He I'm like, I don't make that kind of, that amount of material. Uh, when I started, it was a way to come home from work and use my, um, you can work in steels. You can work in metals, you can work

Stephen J: (07:22)
Like Justin. He uses his hands after work too. completely

Mike: (07:26)
Different way. Okay. Nice. Nice. Got it. Good going, man. So what do you do, Justin? He keeps your hands going there. He STRs the

Stephen J: (07:34)
Guitar. That's what he does. Yeah. I don't know what you guys were thinking you there. I don't know what

Mike: (07:39)
Well, that's what I thought. I, I didn't know, maybe doing some cooking, some pottery. I don't know, playing with some clay, sling some stuff

Stephen J: (07:45)
I don't referring back to Alonzo Montana. One of our former guests. Uh, so pop, pottery. Nice interlude. Thank you. So Mike, what, you know, you got the business going well, hardest thing about starting the business for you as what, uh, was getting

Mike: (07:56)
The word out there and, and deciding where I was gonna go and who I was gonna market to. Um, I got my chops busted quite a bit at work. Oh, you're gonna be a knife maker. And now everybody's like, well, you've been making ice for all these years. Where's mine. And I just don't give 'em away anymore. Uh, I found that, uh, there's an old, uh, proverb that if you give a knife away without selling it, you actually cut ties with somebody. So, uh, unless a knife really calls again, it's, it's artistic. I do have production lines of stuff that I do, but those individual pieces that, uh, that I put together, really those they call. So it's the kind of the spiritual end. Like I said, working with the materials, getting that stuff there, uh, getting your name out there it's for of fire started, it kind of flooded the market. Everybody wanted to be a knife maker. Lucky for me that, you know, one of those judges hundred forge and fire is, is a friend and I've known him 20 plus years. We were together at a ho local hospital before he went. Win-win a, and I went the other way and started working for the so, but, uh, you know, getting to know who I have and, and folks, you know, I, I get that stuff out there. Um, so it's been a, it's been a pleasure to make the, make the blades along the way. So

Stephen J: (09:09)
One of the cool things you do is you go out and you do trade shows.

Mike: (09:12)
Oh yeah, I do do a lot of trade shows. Now I,

Stephen J: (09:15)
You and I talk about this a lot, cuz you get some, some helpers, if you will. Yeah, I do. Let let, why don't you enlighten everybody who you have helping you sell your knives.

Mike: (09:24)
So I, I do have a couple of friends that do naked and afraid. Um, and they have been very supportive of, uh, my blade making and have helped me at different, uh, shows. I've traveled with them to do some photo shoots for some different other makers, doing some catalogs, uh, learned a lot about, uh, outdoors and survival through them. Uh, I've actually been tied into, uh, David West is a professional photographer that works with getting afraid and he's taught me some tricks about photography. Um, and uh, again, those friends from making afraid, you know, if you don't watch the show, those guys are really out there doing their stuff. And there's some really great, great bunch of people that, uh, that I've got tied in with. In fact, it was supposed to be at a nice show in Atlanta with 'em this last weekend, but, uh, due to the, uh, the pandemic, I kind of held off and sure enough, everything opens up the weekend of the show and I was out doing my other projects this weekend.

Mike: (10:24)
So did, did, uh, did the pandemic have any effect on your business? Uh, yeah. I getting out there and doing the trade shows or like my, my big time of the year to get out, I don't do a, of the local gun shows or, or those, uh, I like doing the big, the bigger knife shows. Uh, it just, how, how many of those a year are there roughly there there's quite a few there's there's knife shows all over the country. Uh, but again with the pandemic, but the, the big one I go to is, is the blade. That's the largest one in the world. That's in Atlanta, uh, just with, with the, the state of everything, to where it was, Atlanta was not somewhere I wanted to be this year. And unfortunately I've been watching all the photos and all my friends that are there.

Mike: (11:04)
And that's where I really can see the, the, the quality of what other makers are doing. And, and you get the, uh, the feedback of folks in, in the business, uh, the same as us going to a training and you're talking to other trainers and what, what you do, or if you are an instructor, you know what feedback you're getting. So having another knife maker or collector, pick up a knife and say, wow, this is a really nice piece of equipment. Um, really that makes, makes a big difference. Um, I, you know, like going to the gun shows and stuff, the guys see what you have, but a knife show where somebody's a true collector and, uh, and not coming up with the right word I want right now. But, uh, fishing auto, oh, blade, they know up, they pick it up and say, yep, this is what it's supposed to be. It's it's just not that one you picked up at the gas station or something like that, or, you know, the tool, our hardware store. Well,

Stephen J: (11:57)
Like you said, when your mentor picks it up and, and he's proud that makes you proud. Right. And, and yeah. Yeah. Same with the training. When the guy who trained you is watching you out in the audience and he comes up and says, great job. It it's the same feeling. I know that. And so you got the knife thing going on X eight tactical what's, what's the website, Mike, for people to get to it.

Mike: (12:15)
It's X eight tactical.com or if, I mean, X eight tactical on Instagram or Facebook. Um, but mostly it's the Instagram. So it makes things easy. Um, and you know, people just have to look at pictures. They don't have to read

Stephen J: (12:28)
Anything so you, so you're working at the, the office. Yep. You know, you both time gig, then you got the, the knife thing going on X eight, tackle com selling the knives, making the knives on the side. And then, and then my friend, you find time to go out into the woods and plot and, and play the ultimate game of high to go seek. Yeah.

Mike: (12:51)
So

Stephen J: (12:51)
Now tell me how you're doing at this game. I can, I don't know if people understand what I'm talking about here.

Mike: (12:56)
I'm, I'm losing at this game right now. Uh, losing is

Stephen J: (12:59)
This most of America?

Mike: (13:01)
Yes. Uh, most of the

Stephen J: (13:02)
World, most of the, the world. Oh the world. So see, enlighten me enlighten, Justin enlighten me, enlighten the guys and girls that are listening of what we're talking about.

Mike: (13:09)
So if you remember a couple years back, we had the out laying, supposed sighting that was supposed to have come through New York. I'm sitting there and I'm talking to a, a former, well, he's still involved. I thought he was getting really retired at that point D officer and asked him, well, what's the truth? Do we have big cats in New York? He said, well, I really don't believe in it. Okay. I tuck it in the back of my head. He goes, but I'm working down in chiqua county and I'd get all these big foot sightings, whatever. Again, it's in the back of my head a couple years later, I'm busting chops with the guys at work, and this is how it relates to work. We got a guy that kind of looks like big foot. I go and do a Google search of articles or sightings of Bigfoot in my area.

Mike: (13:58)
And I find one in the local paper that's right down the street. As I disperse that E that newspaper article to a few law enforcement officers, uh, I get feedback from a local guy, uh, also in our program. And he says, yeah, I got a couple of my guys out looking, okay, whatever. I remember that original conversation. I get another, my CHOP's busted by another D guy that I went to college with. And we've been friends, you know, most of our lives, he's still on the job. And I find more stuff in lake. And I end up saying, Hey, there's a conference. I'm gonna go down, take my niece and nephew. Let's see what these, this crazy, stuff's all about. I get it tied up with a gentleman. His name is Steve calls. He is a private investigator from your side of the state, works out of the capital region.

Mike: (14:54)
And he's been on multiple different TV shows from monster quest, America's book of secrets and a few other sundry programs. And Steve goes, Hey, you wanna go give this a shot? Well, I'm looking for something to do to get out in nature. And I pulled into Steve's team of going to look for Bigfoot. Are you making the knives at this point in your life? I am still making the knives at this point. So, and are you carrying a knife when you're gonna go play? How to go seek with Bigfoot? I am carrying a knife. Yes. I am carrying a knife. I just wanna make sure. So, um, Steve invites me along. He starts doing all these conferences. Hey, you want to go along? He's written a couple of books. He is the guy that goes out and breaks down the hoaxes. So when you see stuff like the Georgia Bigfoot, that was actually perpetuated by a law enforcement officer in Georgia, he's the guy that went out and broke that hoax down.

Mike: (15:47)
Um, and, uh, he analyzes and new a lot of his skills as a PI to, to go out and break this stuff down. But there's a lot of stuff that he's done, um, including some film down your way, um, and across into Vermont that stuff's been sent out to scientists and stuff. And then he started introducing me to the lower law enforcement folks, specifically down in the white hall region of New York, where they have multiple law enforcement agencies with reports, seeing something in the seventies. And I've talked to a couple of those law enforcement officials that have been down there that were there. Brian Goling being one, uh, the major one. And I kept talking to more and more on law enforcement folks about different paranormal things. And Steve said, Hey, come on along on my thing. So I would bring my knives along, allow this tactical gear and backpacks encompasses all the stuff that you need to go out in the woods and make sure you get home safe.

Mike: (16:43)
Steve would sells books. We talked to some people and I'd sell my gear. And then from there, um, it kind of expanded. And I started talking to more folks around the country and working with folks down in Pennsylvania and went to a couple of our conferences and spoke to some, some law enforcement, some military folks that had been really into, uh, the paranormal and odd things where you're working at two o'clock in the morning, and you hear something go bumping the night, or you get that weird call out. And you're like, oh, know something strange. And, uh, along with the, the knife shows, I usually go to shot show every year, which is the big shooting in hunting and outdoor trade show in Vegas. And I got talking to a gentleman out there that runs another podcast and, uh, Chuck Porter, uh, and he said, Hey, you know, we really gotta talk about law enforcement, first responders with the paranormal stuff.

Mike: (17:36)
And we've interviewed multiple law enforcement and, uh, folks, he and I together. Um, and they're weird, you know, uh, experiences. And from there, it kind of spun off into a podcast that I do with a medium from, uh, Niagara falls and, uh, Christie London. And Christie's been featured on, uh, destination fear on the travel channel and, um, which is things just keep spinning outta control. So we do a another podcast. Where's my Sage that, uh, we go out and we may do investigations last weekend. We were in Mexico, New York doing a haunted house. Uh, we might grab and do some big footing, but I've gotten to go some really cool places. I've interviewed again, doctors, lawyers, law enforcement, military, special forces guys that have had experiences of the parent normal sort. And, uh, what's, what's one of the, what's one of the craziest experiences you've heard about the craziest one.

Mike: (18:36)
Uh, a gentleman that, that I work with, um, was assigned to a, a, a military unit back in the, uh, late eighties, early nineties was down in south America. And they had something that they came in contact with. And I've talked to a couple of guys in his unit, uh, that they came face and face with what they call the, uh, south south American mopping GU. Um, and because what they were working with was the counter drug stuff. At the time, they couldn't shoot, cuz it would've given their position away to who they were going up against. Uh, and I've talked to a couple other gentlemen that have been out another military guy up in Fort Lewis. That's had, uh, experiences where he went camping and something stood up right in front of him. And, uh, this is a gentleman that, uh, Steve and I have worked with in the past.

Mike: (19:26)
Um, so there's a lot of those, um, sightings that come up the, uh, the paranormal experiences, you know, the guys that see the, the apparitions that, you know, we can't believe that stuff's going on, but you, you just, you wonder, um, what they're actually seeing. Some of the, some of the stuff you just, you just scratch your head and you put it in a notebook and you're like, okay, what are you, what are you gonna do next? You know, it's, it's there. Um, I know a lot of the guys I work with are super into going out and hunting for, for ghosts and, and whatever. And there's a, there's a lot of law enforcement guys that just won't put their names out there, um, saying that they're doing it, you know, and that weekend ghost hunts, a lot of fun, the big footing stuff. It's great.

Mike: (20:13)
You can, you can get out there and you're gonna see some gorgeous country. Um, I've been some amazing, amazing places that you're not gonna get on a private property with waterfalls. And, you know, the streaming Brooks that are just they're, they're talked back there and, and you talked to those folks and like said my and my, my buddy, Steve, he's a, a forensic interviewer, you know, and he's, he's, he's not gonna take a lot. And we got quite a few law enforcement guys that, that I work with, um, right out of the capital region, as well as some other guys on Western New York, uh, a couple of deputies outta Erie and, and stuff like that. So there's a lot more guys involved than you would think about. Um, I talked to a Constable out of Pennsylvania that was working security at a, uh, windmill site and they were having some problems down there. And, uh, he actually got out the car and challenged what he thought was and a hoodie. And when it stood up and it was well over seven foot tall looked right at him and turned around and walked away and he has no problem talking about that particular sighting out in the open and his constituent keep, keep, uh, electing him. So, uh, you must be doing something right down there.

Stephen J: (21:25)
Well, I've directed, I directed a guy here with a who had a sight way back when he's a, uh, he's a, father-in-law a cousin and, uh, I hooked you two up and, and I think you've, you've spoken to him several times and got his story. Um, you know, we, we have, uh, signs around the town here that says, uh, big foot crossing. And I was in Tennessee recently, big foot crossing next five mile else. What, what evidence now we're law enforcement. Tell me what evidence you have that Bigfoot exists and keeps you playing hide and go seek, uh,

Mike: (21:59)
It, it's, it's really weird, you know, the, the stuff we come across and, and I have two scientists that I work with. I mean, these guys, one guy's known world renowned for particular things that he finds, but because we're sure major university, I kind of keep quiet who he does, who he works for and everything. Um, and then we had the other gentleman that had that sighting in south America is, is also also a scientist. Um, you know, I've seen hair that taken, we've put under electron microscopes and everything else like that, that just doesn't compute. I've been up in the top of the Anon mountains, running some really expensive thermal gear search in the area and taking rocks to the face. And I can't explain it. Uh, I was out with two deputies from another agency. We were in a swamp and, uh, we had something run from us on two feet.

Mike: (22:51)
And when it hit the ground, I mean, it hit the ground. And I went back to the same area right after, um, probably within two weeks with another group, same area, it had something black run off into the woods, you know, behind us, the, those little things that pop up, um, the ear screams again. And then you end up talking to more and more guys in the, in the field. And I run, you know, uh, sound recorders that, you know, we analyze the stuff through the Macaulay library through Cornell. Um, I was just down in Florida working with some guys down there and, uh, the technology that's there, you use what's out there, but you're also using the same technology we would use as investigators, the night visions the thermals. So if anything, if I'm got you called out for missing person or something, I got more time on a thermal than most search and rescue guys.

Mike: (23:41)
I mean, you're talking, you know, on a weekend, if my partner's in town five or six hours on a thermal on a Friday night, and you'll get, you know, how many times you see a bear in the woods or something like that, I've got 10 minutes of thermal footage of a bear. I've got a posums, I've got PO finds. I mean, the stuff that's out there, then the nature of photography that keeps me going out there, you know, if something comes across, something comes across it's, it's part of the thing. But when you're getting phone calls,

Speaker 3: (24:10)
Go ahead, have you set up any of, I know they make those, uh, those little cameras. Now you can like stick in a tree, like a, a Hunter's camera, and it'll just automatically take a picture every few seconds. You can leave it out for a few weeks and then I'm gonna go click it later on.

Mike: (24:22)
I I've seen some very interesting trail cam footage. Uh, there's actually some trail cam footage from Vermont. You can look up it's the Vermont trail cam footage I'd been on that property with the gentleman that took that footage. He had something pulling, pulling apples off the top of his tree, like the 10 foot mark and his wife's like, look, you've got this, you got these cameras, put the cameras out there and you're not gonna mess with he's one of those guys, that's got the whole yard posted with, you're gonna get shot if you come on the property kind of thing. Um, you know, but, and there's another place, beautiful granite mark granite face on one side, uh, streams. Um, but they sent that my buddy, Steve went out, did the analysis on that with the exact trail cam, they sent it out to, uh, I can't think of the, it's not Fach can't have think of the guy's name off the top of my head, the doctor, they sent it to who's an, an optical specialist and they did all the measurements and everything like that.

Mike: (25:15)
And so that, that kind of documentation is what keeps me going. It's it's just the stuff that's out there. You know, I there's another guy down Shitakwa, it's got some stuff on trail cam. You're like, okay. And there's stuff that I've seen that people aren't putting out in the public right now, because they're afraid of the ridicule in that that's gonna come behind. But again, when you, when you're talking to multiple law enforcement sources that have seen stuff again, if you, you catch the, uh, the monster quest outta New York, you know, multiple guys down in that white hall area that have seen things, and there's a big festival down there in September. And those guys, a lot of those guys, if they're still living will show up and they'll, they'll tell you their experiences. Um, and the paranormal experiences that go along or are just as, just as crazy. All right, let

Stephen J: (26:03)
Let's tr send into this. So now we're talking ghosts. Are we talking UFOs too? Mike are, are we that

Mike: (26:07)
Level? I, I, I'm not doing UFOs. Uh, cause

Stephen J: (26:10)
I'm gonna tell you as like a six year old, I saw UFO, I'm gonna put it out there. That's a possibility. And, and it ended up being on, uh, unsolved mysteries, that old TV show, uh, on the Tecan state Parkway, I was coming home with my mother from action park, another great place to go that I wish was still around. Uh, but we were coming home to con and all of a sudden Ave of lights, right over top of us, people were pulling over, ends up being on, saw mysteries. I said, so I'm a believer in the UFO. I think I believe more in UFOs than I do in Bigfoot. That's why I'm asking. I need to see some evidence, man, show me some evidence that I can see that

Mike: (26:46)
That's the thing. And if you, Steve, you and I are close enough at age and we know that, um, you go back to the sighting back in the seven in seventies with the, uh, the Bigfoot stuff there in white hall, you're gonna see there was a giant flap in the Hudson valley at that same time for UFOs. Yep. Um, there, that, that stuff kind of goes to, and from about the same time. Um, so, you know, there's the big joke about big foot and UFOs, but you know, there's the same thing. You see cows and UFOs. If you look at the skin Walker and stuff, again, it, when you're coming home at the end to the day from the job, and you've seen how many horrible things that you've seen over the years, it's something to turn around and get your brain and get your brain off of the job.

Stephen J: (27:34)
Sure. Let's go play high to go seek. I get

Mike: (27:36)
It. Yeah. It's, you're out there in the woods. What are you gonna see? And not every click crack, everything you're gonna hear is gonna be Bigfoot, but you're gonna come across stuff. And again, using the tools that we have available to us, um, in, in using that stuff, you're still keeping your, your skillset out there. Are you tracking, are you again, that missing person, kid comes up? Are you looking for that suspect? You know, are you seeing the signs in the dirt? Are you, he signs in the trees are, you know, what flashlights you're using? Are you up to snuff with the gear that you're putting out there? It's just like going to the range and, and putting rounds down range, are your skills still there to turn around and track and find what you're looking for.

Stephen J: (28:17)
And that's one of the things that we love talking about. And Justin will back me up on this one is we talk to everybody on this podcast. It's how did you take what you've learned in your job and transcended moved. It used it, utilized it to what you're doing outside the job and for you, it's the business. And it's the knives and learning about how they work in the best practices. And with, with the equipment that you're, you're big foot hunting with. I mean, to me, I always like a photographer for a crime scene that does photography on the side. He's gonna know the angles, he's gonna know the lights, he's gonna capture that best, that best picture. You know, I like the techy guys that are doing their computer stuff on the side to do my forensic analysis O of the different electronics that we're, you know, you were doing now. So to your point when guys know their equipment, cuz they're using even outside of work, it makes 'em a better, better law enforcement officer. In my opinion,

Mike: (29:06)
You, you know, I, I spent, I've spent the last couple of weeks trying to figure out how to fill my show the best. Well you're looking at infrared. Well that same technology, I'm trying to figure out how to build it, to put it in the guy's swap vehicles or the cars. So when you pull up on scene or you're sitting stationary, how can you use small cameras around your cars for nightmare to make sure you, or that firefighter or that ambulance driver is going home safe at night. So I've been messing around with a whole bunch of infrared stuff, but it's the same stuff I'm gonna use in the field when I'm doing my, my ghost show or I'm doing a big foot thing or doing some paranormal stuff cuz it's there. And, and what's the distance an IR camera's gonna work. Is it gonna work with my Nikon when I'm in the field trying to take photos.

Mike: (29:49)
And is that technology gonna work? Like I said, when you're, when your investigator showing up and he is not using a Pharaoh system, well, what can you use? Well, there's 3d apps that are out there now for gamers that when I show up at a scene, somebody says, oh, well we got print from here. Okay. Well tell me about that. I'm still using my investigative skills when you're out interviewing somebody I'm using, uh, you know, there's, there's a great Lieutenant. I know pieces are really interesting course on investigation stuff, but I wouldn't know who that is off top. My head, keep forgetting his name starts with Steve. I think , uh, anyway, you know, when you're, you're using those interview skills, what are you looking for? You know, are they are the tells there? You know, there's a whole thing, you know like, oh, I saw big foot, well how big were his feet?

Mike: (30:31)
Well, his feet were this big, but you know, my buddy Steve uses all the time. Well, how tall was the grass? Well, the grass was three foot tall. Well, how did you know how big his feet were if the grass to three foot tall, you know? And then you're asking, you know, and you're doing him in your social work the same way you are at work. You know, did you just recently have a breakup? You know, did your wife leave you or your kids moved outta the house? Are you looking for attention? And it's the same stuff we use every day. But then, like I said, you, you sit down and talk to somebody, you watch the, the hair pop up, the, you know, the towels, the nervous, the whole thing that you would see if somebody just saw a car accident in front of him or somebody gets shot. I mean, that's, that's part of the, you know, using that skillset. What's

Stephen J: (31:11)
Your goal, Mike, what's your goal with, with big foot hunting and the paranormal stuff

Mike: (31:16)
It's getting out of the house. it's, it keeps you in shape. Cause you're climbing a mountain. Um, today the, the movie's released today is, uh, on the trail, a Bigfoot journey. And you can see me climbing a mountain with, you know, two kidney stones and three hernias, you know, it's that ability to get up and just rock it up a hill, rock it up a mountain, you know, it's, it's the ability getting out there, um, and finding something different. I mean, do you wanna walk

Stephen J: (31:46)
Hand in hand down main street with Bigfoot at the end of

Mike: (31:48)
This? Hey, if this works, it works. You know, if there's an undiscovered species out there. Yeah. I would love to be the guy proving it for all the chop busting I've gotten, but you would be surprised and you take a hundred and say, okay, you've been out in the woods, you're walking down the thing and you, you notice it five foot up or six foot up. This tree looks like somebody grabbed a twig and twisted it. And you have what looks like spaghetti in front of you or what does that sound? You hear? You know, it's not an owl, you know, it's not a Turkey or a Coyo or something like that. What do you got out there? What's the strange stuff you've seen in the woods. Think about that house clearing. You've done, you know, at three o'clock warning and you know, nobody's in there, you cleared that house with two or three guys, but you know, you saw something move through there, you know, or think about your spy sense when you walk up on that abandoned building and you can tell, this is no good, you know, and what are you walking up on?

Mike: (32:41)
Or, you know, that, that, that early energy you're gonna pick up on there's there's a lot of stuff that's there. You know, I also do, uh, re Kay energy healing, you know, and, and a couple years ago I would been like, yep, this whole Eastern medicine things out the window. But, uh, I got tied in with a forensic surgeon out of Rochester. It works with cancer patients. And when you, you see him throw energy and you're using thermal cameras and bio field imaging cameras, and you're checking and you can see this energy move. And again, you've got places like the Mayo clinic and a lot of the other big hospitals around the country and around the world using this kind of stuff. There's is there stuff we're, we're still, we haven't learned. And it being in our field, we're always black and white on stuff. There's a little gray area and maybe it's just, I've been around too long. And you know, as we come down to these last couple, you know,

Stephen J: (33:31)
Well, one of the things I was once told, and it was pretty funny, you know, when you say you're a nonbeliever and people say, if I could see it, I'd believe it. Right. I'm heard that a billion times. Oh yeah. Take a pair of night vision goggles, go into your living room in the dark, turn your TV on. What are you gonna see? You're gonna see that light from that remote, you know, pulsate and, and turn that TV on. Normally with the lights on, we don't see that light, even in the dark, we don't see that light from the remote shining for red, whatever you call it, IR, I don't even know what it's called, but when you put those goggles on, it changes your perception. So there's so much in the world. We don't get to see because of what our eyes could do and what their limitations are. So I'm with you. I'm not, I'm still not sold on the Bigfoot thing yet. I'm hoping, I'm hoping to see you walk down main street with Bigfoot. I really am. Yep. But if anybody anybody's got any experiences, Mike, how do they reach you on that one? Do they go to X eight tactical? Where, how do you want them to reach out to you on that? Uh, that's

Mike: (34:28)
Instagram that's, uh, either where's my Sage or tactical Bigfoot research. Those are my places to get me for that kind of stuff. Most of the, uh, the experiences I turn over my buddy, Steve, and we, we kind of follow up if it is a little law enforcement or a military guy, they can reach out directly to, uh, with a Bon, you know, with bonafides. I will definitely follow up with you on, on that to, uh, tactical Bigfoot research. And there you got sounds in the background. You're

Stephen J: (34:55)
Kidding. And all of a sudden there's some serious thunder you're kicking. I think, uh, I think that's Bigfoot shake in the tree gets the house. Um, really

Mike: (35:01)
Sure. Well, you know, lately Hudson valley has been a pretty big hotspot for stuff. So, uh, you know,

Stephen J: (35:09)
It wouldn't surprise me. I'm just saying I seeing is believing. Go ahead, Justin.

Speaker 3: (35:13)
Yeah, I gotta ask. So, you know, obviously you guys are always running towards the danger while everyone else is running away from the danger. Uh, as there ever been any times when you're out there and something happens and you're like, I I'm getting the hell outta here. This is, this is just too crazy for me.

Mike: (35:30)
The, there have been a couple of paranormal ones. You just, you, you shake your head and you're like, no, just the Juju is just bad. There's, there's a loca. , there's a location up here that, um, I, I, I just, the house, it just doesn't feel right, but there's been multiple deaths on the property. Um, I know a, another law enforcement guy that spent time there as a kid. And when you bring it up, the kid, the guy's a big burly guy. He'll, he'll start to a tear up. You'll watch all those signs of traumatic effect. And, uh, but there's a woman that hung herself in the barn. There's supposedly a kid buried in a wall in the house. There's a major Indian battle on a property. It's just, it's you get near it. And every, you know, the, the guys I know that are in, in our business, they don't like in there, you know, there's, there's places you, you talk to cops.

Mike: (36:19)
I mean, I'm not going to that place. It just doesn't. But there's other things. Yeah. You're just gonna go, you know, it's, it is what we do. We, we run towards that kind of stuff. Like I said, I, I took a face full of rocks and the other around ele were top of the car and, and one right after another, got hit in a face and explain it through the area. There's nothing there, but you know, you're always gonna do it. You know? I mean, if it's, you're gonna try to figure out if it's a bear, if it's a cat, you know, is it a pack of coyotes? I've been surrounded by coyotes a couple of times out there, you just, you you're going. But the, that, that ability of being out there in nature is just the, the best part of things. So,

Stephen J: (36:59)
So Mike, if you could go back to 21 year old Mike, or, or any 21 year old out there right now, what, what's the advice that you'd give them, you know, to, to get to where you are, uh, whether it's in professional work, uh, in the business world or, or big foot paranormal hunting thing, what's some advice that, you know, you, you wanna pass on to the, the youngsters,

Mike: (37:19)
Huh? 21 year old me. Um, first of all, figure out exactly what courses you should have taken in college. Uh you know, I took the criminal justice and the archeology route when I tried to apply for a certain federal agency, I was told no, those weren't the degrees. Uh, I unfortunately had injuries the first half of my career to kind of change my path. I work for a small agency. So I've had a chance of doing a lot of things. A lot of folks don't in bigger agencies. Um, I probably would've finished out my masters in public administration or, or, or archeology, um, but go seek, get the best education. You can have the best time in the journey and make the most you can, if there's a class that's offered, if there's a program, you can jump on, do it. Sometimes you gotta pay out of pocket.

Mike: (38:14)
Um, and if it feels like it's not a career, if it feels like it's a job, it's not for you. And, uh, I've had a lot of rewards coming out of this thing and I've seen some nasty stuff. And, um, but I wouldn't give it up. It's I've been sitting in a cop car since I was 14 years old, started as a police Explorer and intern and dare role model and everything. And I had some great, great mentors get is if you're gonna go into this field, go find a, an agency to really get to, to get to know those people. And, uh, you know, my biggest to honor, I got ready to put a, I put a program. I work a program up here and coordinator program and inviting my mentor to that, you know, just before he retired, unfortunately with COVID, we couldn't have that meeting, but to know, I, I, I made it for him and, you know, followed in his footsteps way I would, should have.

Stephen J: (39:12)
So, and a question that we ask every guest, when he, what is a hero, what do you define a hero?

Mike: (39:20)
I am not a hero. A hero is that guy that goes into that building that puts himself up and be of, and beyond everybody else, it gives back to his community. I'm not there yet, but, uh, I know a lot of folks that are, those are the guys that are quiet, that are not looking to put their names out there that want to really stay quiet behind the scenes, but they're given 100% every day that they go to work or they show up at that scene, you know, and it doesn't have to be on the job. It could be that, that young lady or young man walking down the street and find somebody that's fallen just started to give first aid care, but they didn't do it for the, the, the glory. They did it just to kind of take care of the community.

Stephen J: (40:03)
Well, I, I beg to differ. I think you are a hero. And I think that anybody that puts on the uniform, or as I always say, the superhero outfit, uh, and goes to help people without asking any questions, just when they need help is a hero. And I also think you're hero because of the information that you're sharing with, with the others on this podcast of, of activities outside of the job. Um, and, and you're always one guy I know that I could call, if I have a question about something, you know, or if you don't know, you're gonna send me to the right person, that that's a hero too, Mike. So I want to thank you, uh, for being you for doing do, and, and also just for being on this podcast with us.

Mike: (40:40)
Well, I appreciate you, gentlemen, let me join you today. Um, it is all about networking. You know, that's probably something I completely forgot to hit. And Steve and I will speaking on net a couple weeks, but networking is a huge part of things. And you guys putting us together and putting a network together, finding folks, something else to do besides we're at 10 all today is important. So I appreciate you. You both let me join you and for your listeners for listening to me mum for an

Stephen J: (41:10)
Hour. Well, we appreciate you, Mike. And, uh, we'll talk soon, man. Yep.

Mike: (41:13)
Appreciate it. Yeah. It's great. Great meeting you, Mike. Thanks for being on here. You're

Stephen J: (41:17)
Welcome. I don't know, Justin, after talking to Mike, if we're ever gonna have somebody on that can mention their affiliation with so many TV shows. Yeah. What a laundry list of, uh, things he's been a part of. I mean, forged in fire, huge fan. I love watching that show, um, who doesn't love naked and afraid.

Justin: (41:33)
I

Stephen J: (41:33)
Mean, my wife will say every night, it's naked and afraid in my house. uh, you know, I've seen it, um, too crazy for me. I could be called Bigfoot. You could be called Bigfoot. the, uh, the information that he gave us. I mean, if anybody's had any of these experiences with the paranormal, with Bigfoot sightings, reach out to Mike, he is 100 hundred percent honest as they come with with trying to help you out and investigate the, this activity.

Justin: (41:58)
Yeah. You know, it was funny. Uh, we, we mentioned at the beginning, I mentioned at the beginning of the show that, uh, reading his biography, you know, that, that whole, the whole Bigfoot thing really stood out to me, but it really did make a lot of sense when he put it in context of how you can have this extracurricular act activity. That might sound a little crazy at first, but when you're using all the talent and all the skills that you've learned throughout your career, that that's a special thing to be able to do that. Well,

Stephen J: (42:22)
That's, what's so interesting about this podcast and all the guests we've had is to always to hear about the skillset you learn and what you can do with it. And I think to me, that epitomizes what behind the 10 is extraordinary things on the job, but taking that and doing extraordinary things when your badge is in the locker, that being said, man, uh, great day today.

Justin: (42:42)
Yeah. Great interview. It was great. Having Mike on that was a good time.

Stephen J: (42:44)
Look forward to the next one. Absolutely. So everyone be safe and take care of each other.